SEKIRO: SHADOWS DIE TWICE 💀

[Felix]

yeah, but the traversal in bloodborne is still a lot more weird and forbidding, and the challenge is a lot more cumulative, like those demon’s dungeon crawler how-far-have-I-gone-now vibes. one aspect of sekiro’s design that was more thoughtfully integrated than I initially gave it credit for is the extent to which you’re trying to literally cheat death and gain the upper hand in this otherwise very balanced combat by any means necessary (the owl fight is a great diegetic reinforcement of this), but it really limits the opportunities for regular traversal to be anything other than trivial or sloppy.

something else I liked is that, while the overall structure of the world does nothing for me and seems like a wasted opportunity compared to lordran or yharnam, the scope and the pacing and the options available to you at any given time are generally on point (unless you get stuck on one of the very few unintuitive mandatory bosses, but there are far fewer of these than it initially seems) and your next steps are always just barely oblique enough, even in the case of the hidden endings.

also I did get a posture break on the first two forms of the true monk fwiw, just not the first fight or the third form of the second fight

[Tulpa]

@Felix

yeah, but the traversal in bloodborne is still a lot more weird and forbidding

I mean we’ve talked about this before. I remember you finding those woods really ominous and imposing and confusing whereas I just saw it as a straight A to B route with no variation.

We process level design in different ways! I found absolutely nothing weird or forbidding in Bloodborne past the first… half hour.

[Felix]

in fairness I think I played them on a projector with busted contrast

[Rudie]

I ended up believing Tulpa and Felix are both right about Sekiro.

[BustedAstromech]

@Felix

it really limits the opportunities for regular traversal to be anything other than trivial or sloppy

I think they’re trying to accomplish two things in the normal, non-boss level spaces:

1. Preserve the ‘dungeoneering’ style of level design they’ve been honing for decades, with thoughtful encounters, traps, and storytelling through level design
2. Create an optimizable, very fast stealth action route than can be learned and run through quickly when repeating level content to enter a boss room or while backtracking

And I think the latter works against the former, it risks trivializing the normal level content. At its best it plays tense and scary once or twice and then the player achieves mastery, and when this works (it almost always works for me, every-slow and cautious), it’s only an improvement, making repetitive level paths faster and smoother.

At its worst, it gives the player type who would run past enemy content in earlier games something to engage in and improve at while maintaining speed; it’s design responding to abusive patterns they’ve seen players engage in. Playing as fast as possible doesn’t mean running like a doof from a pack of give up skeletons, it means sneaking and backstabbing and leaving a trail of blood, fully inside the character fantasy.

[Felix]

yeah, I think their design goals are fairly self-evident, especially by comparison to the gaping holes in their universally beloved earlier work. but … everyone loves those holes!

[dylan]

luv ur usage of marmite here tho i cant say i know what it means exactly

[LWJoestar]

you either love it or hate it, there’s no in between

[dylan]

Oh right yeah that makes sense

[LWJoestar]

[Victor]

I finally finished this game with the normal ending, last night, after going back to it a week or so ago.

@sleepysmiles

Learning a path to efficiently clear out everyone before fighting the boss became its own fun little ritual

My final review is this is the worst part of the game and they should have, in their quest to strip the fat from the dex-build 2-shotable Souls carcass and really tighten down all the screws, just gone ahead and completely jettisoned death and its annoyance-as-punishment consequences, and then done whatever it takes to make that game interesting. Instant retry, credit feed, no load screens, no forced cool down to make you forget the one weird juke animation, no reverting to previous phases, no memorizing the timing on when you can press start to skip the cutscene.

But also, cool game.

[Dracko]

https://twitter.com/sekirothegame/status/1288474861397053440

On October 29, FromSoftware is releasing a free update for all players that will introduce several new features to the game. These include the ability to rematch bosses, tackle boss gauntlets, perform player movement recordings, and more.

Reflections and Gauntlets of Strength – Old and New Tests for the One-Armed Wolf

The Sculptor’s Idols are not only places of healing, but also tools for self-reflection. The Wolf felled many a foe in his journey for revenge, and in reflecting on these memories, he can gain an even greater sense of understanding and pride for his victories.

With this update, you will be able to take part in Reflections of Strength ; re-matches against any previously defeated boss that can be accessed through any Sculptor’s Idol. These Reflections may help in preparing for Gauntlets of Strength , single-life challenges that will truly test only the bravest warriors… or the most foolish.

As by definition of a Gauntlet, if the Wolf dies at any point, he must start over from the beginning. You like a challenge, right?

A Wolf in Different Clothing – New Outfits

Sculptor’s Idols will also offer the ability to change the Wolf’s outfits , with three to become available with this update, including “Tengu” and “Old Ashina Shinobi. Two of these outfits are unlocked via Gauntlets, while the third is unlocked just by beating the game once.

All outfits are purely cosmetic in nature: They are accoutrements to your achievements within Sekiro .

Remnants – Recordings for Recovery

Whether you are a new player ready to experience Sekiro for the first time or are gearing up to face past challenges once more, expect a brand-new player movement and text recording system that could aid you and your fellow wolves on your journey.

Remnants are recordings of what a player does in-game for up to 30 seconds at a time and are available for use after the game’s tutorial. After a player records their Remnant – whether it is an epic takedown of an enemy or a flawless demonstration of a tricky movement technique – it can be uploaded along with a written message so that other community members can play it back. Through these Remnants, one could hope that they or others may gain the knowledge and further insight to overcome their current obstacle. For those seeking ultimate guidance on traversing treacherous areas, or seeking hidden alcoves or curious cubby-holes, these records may prove a blessing from the gods.

If a community member watches and then rates a Remnant, the owner of it will have their HP recover for free, allowing them to get back into the fight quicker without the use of a Sculptor’s Idol, or consumable items such as Healing Gourds.

[bib]

wow

[Titus]

New update is live!

[Broco]

I thought I’d check out the new Sekiro boss rush mode real quick last night and ended up in “one more try” mode and (unwisely for my sleep schedule) challenged Inner Genichiro until 4am. They kept it a little bit secret that this update added new variants too, it was a pleasant surprise. Even though the new Genichiro is about as hard as vanilla endgame bosses, Gyoubu and Butterfly are more timesinks than actual challenges, and G’s big new move is actually very punishable so I’ll get him sooner or later. The main thing the boss rush context does is you need to demonstrate a high level of consistency, beating bosses 10% of attempts is good enough to win Sekiro normally, but now you really need to prove it’s not just luck.

The first rush seems a bit intended as practice for the second, main rush which I’m terrified of. It’s like 10 bosses and the next-to-last is Sword Saint, and the last one is a mystery boss (I would guess it’s most likely to be a variant of Owl Father, especially since “Inner Father” makes thematic sense as a boss name, but they might surprise me). One thing I learned from the first rush is not to waste time ahead of time practicing against who I expect to be the final boss, as the variants punish things that work against vanilla so your first run to the end is guaranteed to be toast. And it let me practice super Genichiro as soon as I revealed it once.

[Tony]

Guys, I have started Sekiro and so far I am loving it, especially because I need some tactics to take on the enemies at times. I am at the Hirata Estate and I have hit a “wall”: I was killed by Juzou the Drunkard and I am wondering if there is a quicker way to reach him, than having to face all the enemies between the Buddha statue and him.

Also, I cannot get the timing right for the Mikiri counter when fighting the Shinobi hunter. Should it be immediately after the red signal (for his thrust attack) ends? Or should I wait a bit more?

Danke!

[Rudie]

depends on what save point but it is somewhat a run and requires taking out a bunch of dudes yeah. Might want to scroll back to the very beginning of this thread I am sure we gave accurate advice a couple of times over.

[idiot]

fuckin’ love mikiri counter

[Tulpa]

practice mikiri counter with the training zombie npc (whose name I forgot)

you don’t need to press any directional input to do a mikiri counter, so its safer and more reliable to just hit that dodge button

[cylindrome]

maybe just before it ends, but i don’t think i ever went by the symbol. different enemies have different-length windups so it’s probably unreliable to take that as the cue. watch his animations and mash the button when you can see his pike about to thrust right into you. if you’re too early it may not matter as you’ll take a forward step and be in range to immediately try it again.

the tempo of the combat is frantic and you’re expected to miss a few beats as you figure it out. for example i’m pretty sure the purpose of the guard mechanic is less for strategic immunity as it is in dark souls and more as a safety buffer so that you are less hesitant to try deflecting (considering there is a hard mode which removes it)