#CYBERPUNK 2077 šŸ’»

Significant

Itā€™s something like 6-8 months of feature time from an engineer and a couple of UI artists and a good chunk of character art. Iā€™ve seen it in the spec and dropped twice because nobody is willing to eat that cost

I donā€™t think so but when everything is mocapped artists get really picky about walk cycles; weā€™re presently considering 6 mocap actors for slim/med/heavy masculine/femme body types, to results that I canā€™t even observe

Itā€™s very similar to the way they worry over sword edges clipping through walls. Everybody realizes itā€™s a game and there are a million ways to make it look stupid already

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gonna start a game dev consultancy where i just yell ā€œgender is fakeā€ at rooms full of ubisoft engineers

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Cyberpunk just seems like a game where it would be thematically appropriate to have characters with weird digital distortion modifications in their voices! Why not get weird with it! But this is the question Iā€™ll be asking about everything in this game, because itā€™s not that kind of game

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Iā€™ve never played the tabletop game but it seems like there were some concessions for transgender roleplay but it came with some hamhanded mechanical costs like a penalty to ā€˜humanityā€™.

This was removed in later rulebooks but I donā€™t know if the tabletop developed roleplay with more fluid gender concepts or if it was left to homebrew stuff. In any case it seems like something CD Projekt RED would have had to consider at some point given how extensive body modification and bodily expression plays into the themes of the original rpg. Either it was decided against for scope reasons, was overlooked due to unconscious bias or was deliberately avoided for political reasons.

This isnā€™t actually in the core rulebook, this is a supplement based on a series of problematic but extremely well intentioned scifi books that were a big influence on CP2020 (that I have been meaning to read to have Tigressā€™ Official Transwoman Opinion on).

Also to give mechanical perspective on this: the humanity cost thing is problematic but in the context this is one of the lowest humanity costs in the game, and no other instance in the entire game features a specific note that you can just skip humanity costā€¦so Iā€™m actually pretty sympathetic to this personally.

(also the original conception of humanity cost in the game wasnā€™t that getting a robot arm made you less human, it was getting a Google Brand Google Arm meant that your arm was always filtered through a corporate conception of what an arm was and should be, which was dehumanizing. Anyway, this has been Tigressā€™ cyberpunk tabletop RPG discourse corner)

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This seems like more of a trap than it is. The ostensible problem is: we want to depict people losing their humanity as they undergo further and further body modifications, usually depicted as like an ā€œessenceā€ score or something. But if sex reassignment is a body mod, how do we say that people getting sex reassignment arenā€™t also losing ā€œhumanityā€ with that same mechanical hook?

Solution: you can keep the same framing and just say that sex reassignment is a medical procedure like a kidney transplant or open heart surgery and not a body modification like giving yourself Wolverine claws. Which I think has the advantage of being true. That they donā€™t really consider this possibility isnā€™t a failure of imagination, per se; itā€™s a failure of perspective stemming from a social norm at the time of writing that surgically altering sex characteristics is just as weird and scifi as surgically altering a cannon into your arm.

Better solution: destroy the frame entirely. The idea that having night vision eyes or super muscles destroys my natural empathy and makes me an inhuman monster is pretty obviously stupid. Recenter the conflict over changes to the mind, not the body. If I get cyberware that filters toxins out of my blood, who cares. If I get cyberware that directly interfaces my brain with the internet, wellā€¦

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dammit Tigress

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ā€œcounseling cancels the humanity costā€ is an all time great gaming jargon sentence

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this is all making me think about the weird mis-allocation of ā€œdifficultyā€ when it comes to game dev just because like

rami ismail has a thing where he talks about how the industry is so good at presenting solutions that seem like magic where you just put on a suit with grey balls on it and act out the scene and BOOM suddenly itā€™s perfectly rigged, animated and textured in the game

and itā€™s so frustrating to think that weā€™ve set up audiences to think that thatā€™s how the process works but as soon as gender expression or racial identity comes into play the animators and rigging artists and texture artists spontaneously pop into view, and theyā€™ve only been trotted out to prove that ā€œitā€™s a lot of work, actuallyā€

the industry is rendering all this work invisible until itā€™s called upon to change, upon which the work becomes supremely visible, but not enough to you know, pay anyone above 5% of the salary bobby kotick makes

none of this is actually new or particularly provocative I just kind of hate how it is rn

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Going to add one more detail that slipped my mind: The book also introduces the concept of bioware instead of cyberware. Bioware costs much more, but the ā€˜humanity costā€™ is reduced to the lowest possible die roll.

In this case, mechanically a bio-modded version of the procedure would be 1 point, literally the lowest cost in the entire game, so low it wouldnā€™t even register in any of the mechanics.

Iā€™m just expanding on myself because Iā€™m nothing if not pedant whoā€™s obsessed with context.

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And this is why you were the perfect guest to talk about Shenmue. :heart:

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The additional context is much appreciated.

Still I wonder how CD Projekt regards all this given that the TTRPG was presumably a part of the concept phase.

The more I see of the game, the more Iā€™m convinced that virtually none of it was.

I think Mike Pondsmith has functionally nothing to do with the project for example?

I also know that aesthetically theyā€™ve retained very little from tabletop as well, since most of the mechanical designs were heavily inspired by Appleseed, Bubblegum Crisis, and other 80s anime cyberpunk .

So besides the names this is probably mostly itā€™s own thing.

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Yeah this rings true the more I see GTA: Human Revolution. I think the only major thing they carried over was ā€˜Coolā€™ as a stat from what I can remember of the promo stuff.

couple consulting meetings and thatā€™s it; heā€™s geeked that his thing is now this huge deal (and he was already an endearingly massive geek who would be happy to talk your ear off about Gundam or Macross)

he finagled it into an opportunity for his son to write the Witcher pen & paper game, which I hear is pretty good

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ohhhhhhh momma

support your boys

Pondsmith & Pondsmith

now thereā€™s a heartwarming story

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i only care about this game to the extent that it leads to good things happening to mike pondsmith and his family

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important to note that thatā€™s Lisa Pondsmith & Cody Pondsmith, Mikeā€™s just the pretty baritone here

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I want a Castle Falkenstein reboot

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