traditional roguelikes (aka cataclysm general)

i’ve been a big fan of classic roguelikes since around 2007 when i first played vulture’s eye(a gui replacement for nethack which makes it isometric) to try and break through the daunting difficulty curve of learning to play roguelikes

I am not sure how many of you are into traditional style roguelikes but I thought I would share some of what i’ve enjoyed over the years and if any of you have any to share in kind, or if you want to talk about roguelikes in general or want advice for one in particular this would be a cool place for it

the definition for a traditional roguelike is very subjective but i know them when i see them (ADOM, ToMe, Dredmor, nethack, doomrl, etc), im going to post one recommendation at a time so i dont info dump too hard

cataclysm: dark days ahead
I’ve probably catacylsm for longer than most of the rls ive played combined and i could probably make a thead about this game alone. this game really stretches the limits of what i would consider traditional, it’s hard to say even in several paragraphs the depths of content and activities available to do in this game but here’s a few of the most notable (in the current stable build):

crafting, assembling and disassembling items and resources
an example of this would be this flashlight recipe, a lot of recipes allow you to use one of several different items to satisfy a requirement, and afterward you can disassemble them to reobtain the materials

character development through training skills (morrowind style) or reading books, made a new character to take some of these pics

upgradable attributes, item encumbrance , protection and temperature
positive and negative traits, bionics and mutations, with several stages of evolution and multiple paths to choose
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tailoring, i’m not sure how op it is in current builds but you can disassemble all the clothing you find when raiding houses into their base materials to make new pieces of clothing, you can learn recipes from books, levels, or from repeatedly disassembling items, all clothing can be modified to add more protection or less encumbrance (removing sleeves), adding more pockets to store items in (only in experimental)
here’s some base level recipes in the menu

fully customizable vehicles
every vehicle in game is made of tiles connected together, each tile represents a section of the car and consists of several parts which can be interchanged w/ some mechanical skill and the right tools, in this screenshot im examining a vehicles driver seat tile
(you can also see damage to the batteries and the storage tank)

npc factions, trading, quests, player owned factions and party members

custom base building and npc deployment

entirely customizable user experience, there are many hundreds of mods and more than a dozen actively maintained graphics tilesets for the game, most of them are included with the launcher and stable release of the game

adjustable difficulty per world, i don’t play on the default settings typically, its worth looking through to change things like speed / toughness of zombies, disabling mutations for monsters, classic zombies mod, no monsters mod, worlds are procedurally generated and nearly infinite, all areas are persistent and any changes made are stored

full feature survival gameplay
the game can be played entirely outside of city environments, harvesting plants and animals and other natural features to produce clothing, tools, and shelter, this also includes seasonal farming and food preservation such as canning and drying

now here’s the catch,
the controls are quite a lot to understand at first, nearly every button on the keyboard is mapped to a function in game, there is a context menu available to access certain commands but eventually you will have to look less and less at references and be able to rely on muscle memory to know what you need to press (here’s a cheat sheet of the keybinds)
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the game is somewhat obtuse at the start, and there are not a lot of long term structural goals for a new player, this has changed somewhat with the addition of achievements in recent experimental releases you have to be willing to make your own goals for what to accomplish in game

theres still more i could say but ill save it for now, if any of you give it a try i would love to give you a hand!
this launcher is the recommended way to play if you want to keep track of your files and stay up to date with experimental builds, and here’s one of the most popular tilesets, removed from the builds bc the current maintainer is a jerk on line)

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I loved the character creation in Cataclysm, also the way cars are arranged in different orientations.

I remember playing a lot of ADOM and DCSS as a teenager, but I never went far in either. I couldn’t ever get into Nethack, but everything I hear about it is pretty cool.

I’m still partial to Brogue because I want to live among interlocking environmental tools. I haven’t played enough Caves of Qud(and I’m not sure if it counts), but it seemed like an excellent combination of ADOM and CDDA

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Huh, Cataclysm sounds intimidatingly complex for a game with permadeath, though I guess that’s balanced by (from what I can tell) not having a set end goal?I’m reading up on it now and I love the kind of maximalist game designer flavour of the current version being “0.E.2”.

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You can disable permadeath fortunately! You are still limited to one save per character(not including manual backups) but you can enable auto saves at select intervals(real time or turns), when you die you can just quit without saving and reload the last save

It’s definitely a complex game but many elements of the game can be ignored until you’re ready to engage with them, a lot of early game consists of scavenging and finding already made items to use, backpacks, shopping carts, plastic and metal scrap and assorted types of tools and equipment from specialty stores

I really enjoy finding a nice suburb, clearing out all of the monsters and making traps and barricades to wall it off so I can start generating power and forging weird swords to hit ppl with

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Those are all ready good rogue likes, I just got into Qud recently, it’s quite difficult at first so I haven’t managed to travel very far, I am definitely a fan of more open ended exploration and setting my own goals, qud and adom and tome rly push the genre in terms of breadth of player choice available

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My interpretation of “traditional roguelike” would be games that are actually like Rogue, instead of the increasingly common, broader definition of roguelikes that includes games that only borrow certain elements from Rogue.

I experimented with lots of these as a teenager. Angband, Hack, Larn, Moria were all somewhat well known roguelikes. These are mostly interchangeable though. They have historical interest, but I wouldn’t play most of them today. Dungeon Crawl is the more interesting culmination of this strain of pure dungeon exploring roguelike.

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IVAN is another fun roguelike that is actively maintained, the source code was released several yrs ago and a small community has formed to slowly add new features and fix bugs
it’s another somewhat difficult but straightforward roguelike, every item is “discovered” so you know exactly what stats and materials items are made of

probably the most interesting element is the material system, body parts, items, and the environment are all made of different materials with different properties, you can also change the properties by using magic spells or wishes, such as replacing your limbs with banana flesh or various types of metal

the github releases also come with a sound pack and music, i am pretty sure many of the sounds are unlicensed but it’s quite amusing to hear, here’s some footage of a newcomer playing for a bit, the first time i saw this soundpack i lost my shit @ all the screaming

if you ever try this game try not to kick any hedgehogs

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Cataclysm is a game I feel I could role-play in easily. Being able to choose detrimental traits and professions is fun in a way that’s not entirely different from being an unlucky idiot in Fallout

Breadth and randomness is great in the beginning, especially when you’ll never get that deep

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there have been so many professions added to cataclysm, if you install the mods included with the game theres probably over a hundred, they all give access to different skills, items, status effects, pets, npc allies, and vehicles


in the last few months they added working helicopters along with a profession that comes with the ability to drive them (and it spawns one next to you)

im really fond of the foodperson profession/ mascot rises scenario, you start out in a fast food restaurant, they usually come with a locked breakroom upstairs that you can make nearly indestructible
here’s the rooftop of a restaurant and the fast food place, you can jump across rooftops and watch zombies fall to their demise(you can speed up the process by placing traps like spike pit and fire to burn them when they land), the solar panels can be disassembled and attached to a vehicle frame to provide power to an area with jumper cable chains


on the ground floor there’s several places to store/cook food and windows you can close or barricade to keep monsters out, there isn’t a gameplay reason to store food in ground refrigerators(car freezers and fridges do work) yet but it is planned to be implemented in the future

another cool spot if you can find a way in are gun stores, you can find lots of firearms and ammo, vending machines also hold ammo to steal or buy


this one has a backroom storage full of crates and an office w/ tools for modifying weapons, the metal doors might be narrow enough to squeeze in a small vehicle as a makeshift garage

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I’ve been playing a bunch of the rerelease of Shiren V recently (which by my own standards is borderline “traditional” rl since there’s a kind-of item permanence (and eventually shortcuts)). I finally beat the story dungeon, and the boss at the end made me almost wish for some sort of colliseum side dungeon where all you did was fight a boss in an arena. All the little tools and item interdependencies they give you make me feel like that could be fun.

Now that I’m done with the story dungeon, though, I’m not entirely sure where I’m meant to go next? There’s almost 30 optional dungeons in the game and some of them assume you’re going into them with endgame weapon/armour while others make you pistol start, and I haven’t found anyone in-game to tell me where to go.

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I haven’t beated the story dungeon yet, but I think there’s some conditions to be met involving the two fox girls that unlocks another area, and there’s something with those cat stones as well

Oh yeah, I think all the NPC companions eventually have questlines involving the Tower of Fortune. I’ll have to look into that!

I really love the idea of special moves based on movement sequences from flend’s 7DRLs DDRogue and PrincessRL

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I played this a lot in school with ascii so the teacher didnt know what i was doing
the creator also made a diablo and alien themed roguelike but doomrl was definitely the most popular
it has sound and music taken directly from doom, it’s pretty short w/ multiple difficulties and a challenge mode and some upgradable traits w/ fun flavor text
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heres how it looked when i first played it back in the day
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compared to a more recent version

its free and small, if you are interested in the setting of doom it’s not a bad way to get introduced to roguelikes


they also have a new game up on steam in early access, here’s hoping they get it finished soon

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I remember having a great time with DoomRL back in the day, it definitely helped me ease into getting comfortable with roguelike methods of control while I was banging my head against NetHack as a teen.

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time to post some of the more esoteric functions of cataclysm
autopickup
im currently trying to make mutagen on this character, so i set up some rules that allow me to pick up the materials i need for it. you could do the same thing if you were trying to get lots of plastics to make synthetic clothing, something like M:plastic and youd get items you could melt down into plastic chunks
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a cool feature of it is the ability to test your rule and see what kinds of objects it would pick up
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zones
you can assign zones to tiles, this includes the interior compartments of vehicles, the unsorted zone is outside


there’s many different item types to sort by

good example of the uses of this feature is going out for a loot run, dumping all the items you find in the unsorted pile and doing the auto sort command

heres one of the characters ive been playing as well, ive taken over a pawn shop because it has reinforced metal bars over the windows so the zombies have a really hard time getting in, along with the metal exterior door to the south which is invulnerable to smaller zombies, in the southwest theres a metal frame stretched across the floor with a battery unit, refrigerator, kitchen and battery charging station which is connected via cables to wind turbines on the roof,
theresa folded crane near the counter so i can remove the storage batteries when they’re full and swap them out for new ones, also useful for powering electric cars and such
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i have a few other characters i could post abt sometime but we shall see

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