not sure if there’s a general FromSoft thread, but
I have failed the first network test
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– https://www.reddit.com/r/soulslikes/comments/1vueal8/the_first_duskbloods_network_test_planned_for/
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There are things I am enjoying about Duskbloods, but I’m also a little perplexed by it. PVP is perhaps just not as compelling to me. I’ll be interested to see if when the game’s full progression structure is in place it’s more interesting.
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I’m in the same boat. I’m just happy that if they were going to split up pvp and co-op they put the co-op game on the platform that makes it easy to play with lots of people
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The top-3-player PvP gankfest at the very end is particularly anticlimactic, but I saw a rumor that it’s going to be only one of many possible final stages of the game.
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I really enjoyed the Duskbloods network test. I like the board game influenced scoring approach where you win by collecting victory points that can be earned in many different ways. You can score by killing other players, by co-op fighting bosses, by killing minibosses, by killing the most regular little enemies, by collecting the most items, by finding secret purple chairs you can activate, and more. Basically, excelling at any one aspect of souls-like gameplay can net you points.
There are even rare missions that pop up that you can score with, like racing to the top of a clock tower to ring its bell, or hunting down one particular “rival” player, or allying with a particular former lover player and winning.
It adds up to a lot to learn, but the variety means that different playstyles are viable and I expect the game will stay fresh longer. I already think this is way more fun and imaginative than Nightreign.
I’ve been playing exclusively as Zork, the pudgy diving suit robot man. He can hover in the air for a second and then launch himself like a rocket at another player, and if he misses then he can quickly turn mid-air and shoot back at them again like a charging bull. It’s such a fun, stupid move that I couldn’t stop using it, even when it didn’t benefit me at all. When Zork wins a match, he very slightly extends a proboscis into the blood goblet!
I had a couple forum goers at my place during the first night of the network test, and we were having a good time exploring it. I sucked at first, but I managed to win a match by slamming into someone with the human rocket move. A photo finish!
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This is also great because it defeats the gamer instincts I always saw in Nightreign where you’d see all the Pro Gamers trying to overoptimize their shit with a pre-baked strategy, just running straight from cathedral to cathedral and then hitting every item on their checklist one after another. I’ve played a few matches of Duskbloods where I’m just trudging along the map killing little guys and picking up items like I’m just playing some low key Dark Souls, and I’ve gotten enough points that way to stay in the game til the end.
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Nightreign is honestly pretty good about having a relaxed meta just by its nature as being co-op. I run a build based on using dumb, slow, loud, obnoxious dragon spells, and my teammates just have to tolerate me all the way to the end no matter how pro they are. In a competitive game the meta players would just knock my dumb dragon ass out of the match
Duskbloods does seem like it has room to be silly though, just based on some of the goals I’ve seen that can create odd interactions between players. Inexplicable bonding moments with the randoms you meet in Souls games is what I’m all about
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Crazy that the coop game is less chill than the pvp game
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yeah I really enjoyed my experience with the network test, too.
I tried every character except for the old man (who also looks cool), but the only 2 matches I won completely were with Albert.
he felt the most balanced to me, although I did pretty well with Zork and Trang Lanh, too, but never made it to Phase IV edit: I did make it to Phase IV with Trang Lanh. all the characters are really interesting, but I did the worst with the sniper, Layla. I think she seems great, but I just couldn’t really figure out the play style to make it work for me.
I like all the little ghost helpers, but Nia, Sister of the Briar, was just really cool and my overall favorite.
the game is more fun than I thought it would be, and also looks a lot nicer than that first reveal made it look. i’ll definitely pick it up when it comes out
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I ONLY played Zork (aside from the tutorial where they make you play as Albert) because he was just too cool not to. The guy’s weapon is a big strip of undersea electrical cable! How could I refuse. I’m going to look forward to trying the others when the full game releases. The guy who turns into a dinosaur looks pretty fun. That dino move is unhinged, it’s so fast! The sniper looks interesting too, very different playstyle than usual for a game like this.
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yeah, Zork rules.
I actually really disliked having to kill any Zorks, because he’s just a little metal guy
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I really liked the senator’s aristocratic bearing so I played 4-5 matches with him. He has so much implied backstory! His “lost love” sigil and that description text saying one of his skills is the “emblem of fratricide”.
His dino move requires perfect timing and spacing because the dino stands still for a second or two after biting. It’s much more situational than it looks and actually got me killed a lot of times. The other less dramatic things he has going for him are a heal-on-block effect, a swipe-and-backdash special move, and his heat-seeking magic bird. Ultimately though, he really is all about the T-rex because he unlocks on level 6 so you can start abusing it even by the end of phase I.
I think I made it to phase IV with him twice but ultimately my only victory was also when I switched back to Albert in the final hour of the network test…
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I think timers and rougelike elements naturally solve a lot of game design issues and it’s not too surprising From would go this direction when fleshing out their multiplayer modes. Timers are stressful but they do solve the issue of why not just farm easy enemies until you can steamroll the game. Rougelike elements are ubiquitous and maybe annoying at this point, but it does solve the problem of why engage with upgrades and different abilities instead of just getting the best build and never changing
Which I think is kind of neat because From’s design has always been utilitarian to me. Like the original stamina bar is not flashy but it’s solving this design problem that had been present in every early 3D combat game I had ever played: why not just spam your best moves? Or flasks solving the issue in most RPGs where you can build up endless healing potions if you want to
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Those are boringly common solutions at this point, but what I find more interesting is they moved away from the “closing circle of death” to dramatically concentrate players as the timer runs low.
The ritual area is entirely voluntary and you can just ignore it and keep doing whatever you were doing until the timer runs out if you like. Or you can go to the ritual area at the very beginning of the phase and scope out the golden glowing spots indicating where the stakes will appear, and come up with a plan to get the jump on all the other players.
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The experience point vs virtue point distinction is also superficially the same idea as “resources vs victory points” from euro-tabletop-games, but I gradually realized it’s very different in practice. You need virtue to make it to Phase IV, but once in it, virtue is directly bad because virtuous players take slightly more damage from other players, and it’s indirectly bad because it makes you look threatening.
In the early game, even though you won’t get culled yet for low virtue and, objectively, getting XP or kin/skill upgrades has way more leverage, it might be a good idea to get some anyway to look like a halfway credible alliance partner. Whereas in the late game, the smart play is to get the bare minimum virtue to end up in third place, use that extra time to acquire more combat power, and surprise the higher two with how strong you are.
What to minmax when is not only a matter of understanding the mechanics, but also a judgment call involving Machiavellian prestige. In other words, the dynamic is a little bit like a second-place-sets-price auction.
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i’m glad it is because I could literally never find it lol
didn’t realize higher virtue led to higher damage in Phase IV, though!
my strategy was mostly the following:
- kill a lot of smaller enemies and try to take out at least one Trespasser in Phase I to get as much virtue and exp. as possible
- collect as much stuff as possible. both #1 and #2 often helped me get extra virtue for being one of the top collectors or killers in the match
- keep recruiting ghosts until I get one I really like and then max them out asap
- keep going after Trespassers and try to get into the co-op battles whenever possible (either by starting it, or accepting when requested). It was not, however, clear to me why I wouldn’t always get invited, as it seems to happen without any player input
- seek out those dark thrones to get flame virtue
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Yeah I think there’s a path for PvE specialists to focus on trespassers, and PvP specialists to focus on the ritual zones. Both options kind of intimidated me at first, so I tried specializing in soloing non-trespasser Great Foes for most of the network test, but that never really got me anywhere (they’re harder than they look and they give underwhelming rewards). I’ve concluded that Great Foes are a situational choice only for when you have a particularly strong Kin for the phase you’re at.
I think the people getting crazy 150+ points of virtue must surely be focusing on ritual zones but that’s just a guess. In the network test there was a narrow window of opportunity to like, be the only player to realize those stakes are actually in the sewers while everyone else is milling around uselessly aboveground. (I think the map needs a little more work…)
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oh, another thing I left out is that about 80% of the time (unless I felt really underleveled), I would usually choose to try fighting other players if I ran into them.
except one time, someone and I were connected via a sigil, so we met up, but then just stared at each other because we had no idea how to do anything with that information. my wife later looked his up for me and involved holding Y and pressing up on the d-pad? who knew.
another time, a Senator player formed an alliance with me so that, I guess, our little helpers (kin) would not attack each other as we fought a big beast together. then he kept emoting at me and talking about love.
anyway, it isn’t clear to me if killing other players helps at all in the long run, but it just felt correct, to me.
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