Chrono Cross

This post got too long so it is a new thread:

I just got to The Twist in Chrono Cross. So it is time to talk about it. This was my last Pledge Game of the year after giving up on Card Fighter’s Clash, Dragon Quest 1, and Final Fantasy Tactics. I started Cross at the end of last year and as opposed to those other games giving me reasons to quit Cross is so indifferent to giving you a reason to play more.

It is so indifferent to the player’s presecence. It is like bureaucracy. Everything takes a little too long. Everything in the main city is screens apart from another and in barely marked doors. There is little 4 second pauses all over the game. The pile of tutorial text does nothing to explain how to play the game. It is continually more and more open and your only clue where to go is one thing a character said somewhere.

Trying to recruit characters demands a guide. It’s obtuse and arbitrary. I got mad a semi-required item was hidden behind talking to an NPC three times that wasn’t even near the place it was needed (it makes sense contextually but it’s an example.)

Then you need to make sense of the Elements system and what is finite and what you just need to equip. Or how to upgrade weapons. Do you dissamble weapons? Do you trade in elements or body parts? What exactly am I doing? Crap where am I supposed to go now? This feels like a SaGa Game.

Luckily there are dozens of FAQs though I would love just a meaty physical guide to flip through. And the game is not that difficult in practice though the first 10 hours of random battles are slogs. I’ve been playing the game on mute because at this point I hate the normal and boss battle themes. Don’t worry everyone I’ve listened to the soundtrack for 21 years ever since @geist praised it 6 forums ago. It’s really great just…the battle themes remind what I am about to do for 2-5 minutes of my life.

Also that without a guide the most efficient way to do the boss battles is wait for the boss to cast A Big Spell, run away, equip a trap (also buy all the trap spells), and get back in the battle. You can run from every battle and are supposed to play in this well not tedious, but it takes longer than you’d like. Everything in the game takes a little too long. This is why people use guides I yell, also clearly part of the design doc for this one.

All that said. Boy is the game pretty. Thanks 99% accurate Mister Core. Your save states save me time. I have regularly sat in awe at what the Playstation 1 was pumping out. There was the elevator door that pulled open and flooded the light of the prerendered background and I went “Now that’s Ray-tracing.”

It is so full of decisions even when that decision is This Is Not a Sequel To Chrono Trigger. Except when it is. You can’t even get all 44 characters in one playthrough. Not that the characters matter really. They are all flavor. Again player indifference.

Unlike say Xenogears or even FF7 this is the most coherent so far PS1 Square game With Themes. Even though I think I need to replay the beginning of the game again because I do not remember or understand what happened in the past that is affecting the present. Or maybe I am not supposed to yet. It’s unclear!

Oh yeah going between the worlds is so obtuse as well.

Okay trying to be all positive for this final paragraph. The music is stunning. The graphics are unbelievable. I have to think just enough in the battle system and that it auto-heals you is so great. The character designs are excellent. The characters themselves are sharply enough written given the constraints. It is cool that it has dozens of heavily buried secrets that maybe you could figure out on your own if you tried really hard. I want to keep playing it now and I think I can stick with it till the end.

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i feel like this one example is the opposite? like its entirely up to your preferences for who youre hanging with and i think that cares a lot about the player and what they desire and whatever. your party is a cute outfit you pick out

i guess what i consider player indifference is when theres an unshakeable meta. maybe its math indifference that it doesnt matter what combination of characters you use

i agree about all battle themes in every single rpg though! all of them, they all get annoying after a couple hours and end up muted!

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They do feel like an outfit though I don’t feel like I am gonna learn how they got their scars or their dark secrets or how they feel about uh…whatever the hell is happening in this game I am unclear. not that I want all that. It isn’t that I disagree with how they did it but not sure I enjoy it in practice.

But there are 6 or 7 different kind of characters and you can use who you like and it actually seem to discourage you from switching your party around. If you want to switch out a character for a new one you have to work to have the new character catch up stat and element slot wise. It isn’t really clear if they even can catch up or you need to be prepared to deal with one of your characters being significantly weaker.

It’s a weird game!

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The battle theme worked well in 3 hours text based oppressive dungeon crawler Radical Dreamers. They transposed it to 40 hours Tropical Dream Islands RPG Chrono Cross and it doesn’t fit at all

Character development for CC characters is getting to see a character’s unique level 3/5/7 techs IMO

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RPGs at large beg for a ranking of each piece of BGM sorted by what percentage of the game that tune plays, and if a single battle theme (or any other theme!) comprises more than like 10% of the total playthrough… if you are listening to 1% of a soundtrack for e.g. 40% of the playtime… it’s unconscionable. yet effectively no dev ever fucking designs it differently, what the FUCK

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Just one more reason Mother 3 is the :goat:

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ahem.

A few games tried something different, be it dynamically adding/removing instruments based on flow of the battle, or crossfading between two(+) different tracks based on players’ performance… which means if you didn’t get the hang of it, you ever only heard one version of the same song all the ti—

:tarothink:

ah.
Ahhhh, OK

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The path from from the beautiful colors and carefully designed backgrounds of Chrono Cross to the blurry all-3d ps2 era then to the muddy browngrey of 360 shootbros is one of the steepest aesthetic declines of all time

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The teens were a very dark time in a lot of ways

Figured if a character dies in battle I have to switch them out.

RIP to Funguy dying as he lived, fighting an undead warrior in a cave made of skeletons after eating a mushroom that turned him into a Mushroom.

Current party is a mermaid and a very pretty guy with a Real Gun

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RIP to the mermaid died on the highway.

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you have to admit that the vibes of this game are unmatched, no matter how you may feel how it is executed in the final package. There is no other game i could recommend if someone said ‘recommend me a substitute to CC!’

And the OST rips.

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shoutout to

CAPSLOCK

Knight.

for whatever reason i’m hearing this as a line in a country song

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I was listening to Waylon Jennings as she died.

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Yes.
I have some VG foundational memories with Chrono Cross. It was one of the first RPGs I ever beat, and the second RPG I spent a summer playing.

I had/Have? that physical guide. Certainly did when I played it on my PS2 (I got it later) and had a different “playstyle” than any other human on earth would have come up with.

I only had one hour of playtime a day. But I could read all I wanted. So I’d literally have to look at the guide and prepair and map my progress for what would be ~1 hour in game before the parental arbiter would call time on the session. Under these circumstances a lot of the oddties of the game actually kinda work.

You need to do X Y and Z here to get X character. Except you quickly learn you don’t really need many characters, and most of the stronger (not strongest) and most versatile characters take very little to gather. Also, you can only play with 3 at a time, so… why? After the main characters, and getting Glenn the only character that narrativly grabbed me that took effort.

But yes the soundtrack stays with me to this day, the design and high moments are seared into my mind.

When the Steam release came I did consider a replay, but I know in my hearts of hearts that A) Fast forwarding with an emulator would be neccisary to bother to play this again. B) I’d rather play a ton of RPGs I hadn’t played before

C) More than most games I know this horrible game is best left in the past from a me that hadn’t played trigger and a ton of other RPGs, and remembers it fondly as a middle school summer where beats and moments uplifted my soul for the day, my mother saw my passion and would let me play another 15 minutes more to get to a save to not loose my progress for the day and not udder a word to my father, as I’d spend the next hour plotting for tomorrow.

As @Rudie you really did point out the battle system, especially with bosses is… wonky. In retrospect, I think it’s a beautiful mistake with heart that I wish someone tried to improve on.

TL;DR - this is an ‘interesting’ game not a great one that is unfairly and always compared to Trigger and should have never been a ‘chrono’ game people would be kinder to it with a different title: Surge Cross.

Bounus round: All SB really should know: If you’re not compelled to play through a 60-80 JRPG that’s wonky as hell, go listen to the soundtrack for a few minutes. It’s the highlight of this game and in 5 minutes you’ll get the flavor of it if you click around. Well worth the moment to know this game deserves some legacy.

P.S. I could say more but I doubt more than 5 people will read this incoherent rambling mess I’ve laid down. I don’t hold this game in super high regard, but I have bigger feelings about it than most games, and it’s always tied to Super Mario RPG in my head.

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I did not have the strategy guide, but I did have a 300 page gamefaqs .txt that I printed and held together with a big black plastic binder clip

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Y’all ever seen a .txt file with a table of contents…

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I love Chrono Cross. I was really entranced with its whole vibe back in high school. The existentialist melancholy of it all, the beautiful tropical setting, and that incredible soundtrack… I got all the way to the last boss but found it so difficult that I never beat it. I regret that! I replayed a bit of it recently but fell off of it. It’s kind of a big commitment… But very pleasant to revisit nonetheless. Maybe someday I’ll finish it and see the ending.

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also the twist reveal of the environment is so fuckin colorful and stylistic and just a complete fucking joy to look at. like they made exits and doors hard to parse to force you to dwell in the world a little longer and sometimes while playing it’d be frustrating but I appreciate it solidifying my memories of a lot of those backgrounds

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