Are there good resources to learn the units / simple RPS counters? There are an overwhelming number of units and factories!
Was watching some games on YouTube and it seems like factories are kind of like a mini-version of races in StarCraft, since you stick with your initial factory for so long. Is that true, or are there other considerations/reasons to build extra factories early?
yeah this does sound unbelievably cool even I know it’s not for me
Let’s talk about the 11 starting factories and how they serve as an expansion of distinct factions in RTS.
Starcraft is the gold standard of RTS. It has 3 factions, Terran, Zerg, Protoss: T Z P. This adds variety to the game because the different matchups play significantly differently. Each player can experience 9 different matchups from their perspective. So if you play all 3 factions, you’ll need to know the optimal way to play 9 different matchups. If you only play 1 faction, you only need to know the optimal way to play 3 different matchups. This is a big reason why players end up dedicated mainly to a single faction that is their “Main”. It’s easier to practice 3 matchups than 6 or 9. So everyone can experience diversity of play if they want it, but having to only know 3 matchups, you will still fall into a routine of how to play your Main once you’ve identified the opponent faction. You’re Terran against a Protoss? You’ll need siege tanks to beat their dragoons.
Zero-K has only 1 faction, but 11 starting factories:
You get 1 factory for free that constructs instantly at the start of a match. You don’t know what factory your opponent chose until you spot their first unit. They don’t know what you chose until they scout you or you reveal yourself. Each factory has about 11 or 10 units and plays about as differently as the Starcraft factions. 11 starting factory options for you and 11 possible factories for your opponent means there are 121 possible opening matchups. While not every factory is viable on every map, most of them are and the map pool makes it so that all starting factories are legitimately viable most of the time. Instead of mastering 3 matchups, Zero-K forces the player to accept that they can’t be prepared for what will happen, and must master versatility instead of specific matchups. Adapt to the current conditions or die.
This is the best of both worlds. Diversity of situations that’s baked into the core of the game. I’m still regularly confronted with situations I’ve never encountered before, and need to work out how to solve in real time. “No battle plan survives contact with the enemy” is a design philosophy here.
New factories are expensive enough that players can’t afford them until mid-game. You’ll be stuck with that opening decision for the first ~15 minutes of the game. Many 1v1 matches are over before a second factory is ever built. So you have to ask yourself some interesting questions before the match even starts. What factory best suits the terrain of this map? What factory will my opponent choose? How easily can my factory choice be countered by my opponent? How bad will it be if my opponent plops (building your first free factory) something completely unanticipated? As soon as the match loads, the possibilities are absolutely brimming. You never get a full grasp of how any fight is going to go, so the game stays thrilling and interesting as you try to always juggle more than you can handle.
Cool, it’s like the Chess960 of RTSes. Glad my observations were mostly correct. Helps a lot to compare it with StarCraft since that’s basically the only RTS I know (and even that, only via proxy).
I’m way more excited about a strategy game if I don’t have to memorize an opening book.
did they name this after the DeLillo novel on purpose
From Wikipedia:
Zero-K Initial release 1.0 / October 1, 2010; 8 years ago
Zero K is a 2016 novel by American author Don DeLillo.
how the shit are games like this so obscure? thanks OP.
#1 Godde vs #2 Drone from a tournament in December
How do I do this this stresses me out! I always have too much or not enough! Am I looking for a specific ratio of energy to metal?
Are the arrows supposed to help? Everything is so temporal they feel like they don’t help!
Is there a rule of thumb for how many constructors I should be making?
Metal is your primary resource because it is the hardest to get. All metal spending requires an equal amount of energy spending. A fabricator that cost 100 metal will also cost 100 energy. This means that you always want at least as much energy as you have metal. Also, some units and buildings will consume excess energy to maintain cloak and restore a bubble shield.
After that it gets a little trickier. You can never have too much energy. That’s because excess energy is used to “Overdrive” your Metal Extractors (Mex). When energy accumulates past your storage limit, it is automatically applied to Overdriving your Mex which starts to give percentage gains on each Mex connected via your energy grid. That’s why you’ll see people building “power lines” between their metal spots. Excess energy becomes more metal, which lets you build more energy, which gives you more metal. There is a tooltip that will pop up when building an energy production building that will tell you the estimated time it will take to pay for itself in extra metal gained from overdrive.
That’s all a lot to take in and you can safely ignore it until you get your bearings.
Just follow some simple guidelines instead:
(in order of importance. if nothing else just follow rule #1)
It’s always cheaper to make more Mex than it is to overdrive fewer mex by making more energy. This is how to game balances map control with economic development. If 2 players have equal map control, the player who has a stronger overdrive economy has advantage. The risk/reward is that you have to spend more upfront on your economy instead of your army to get an advantage later. Also, your power grid becomes a point vulnerable to attack if your unable to maintain map control.
Note: Reading this back just now, and boy it must look overwhelming
Nah, it’s very helpful! That all makes sense to me.
A few more things I overlooked because they are so fundamental I forget to even mention them.
Always be expanding. Always take as much mex and territory as is possible. If you don’t take at least half of the map in a 1v1, then you’re already losing. More metal = better army = victory.
Spend all of your metal. Excess metal is lost and wasted. Metal is the most important resource so don’t waste it by having excess metal.
Don’t build a storage container unless your commander has died or will probably die soon. And then, only make one. Follow this rule until you’ve really figured out how things work.
A pretty good tutorial on how the economy works.
I haven’t played this game much yet, but I’ve been thinking about it a lot! There’s a lot of interesting stuff to chew on, and I like to have a good high level view before I dive in too deep.
As a beginner I wish this game was more legible in general. Too many of the units look very similar, I find the symbols aren’t distinct enough, and a lot of maps have samey ground textures that make elevation hard to see at a glance. A few graphical / design tweaks would go a long way in improving the overall readability of the game.
SC maps tend to be more constrained, too, so these more open maps sort of add to the chaos. I find it difficult to track all the units moving around the map, even as a spectator.
While I’m at it, here’s some more tutorials that I used to figure out the game when I was starting. These are by GoogleFrog, the lead developer on Zero-K.
This one is about combat and maneuvering.
(EDIT: this Video is slightly out of date. What he calls Fight (F) is now called Attack (A). What he calls Attack (A) is now called Fire (F). This was a change for the better a few years ago. Just swap A and F when he mentions it in the video)
This one is about terraforming. You can safely ignore terraforming until you feel like you already understand the basics of everything else. I still have to return to this video sometimes when I’m trying to remember how to do something tricky.
I agree that the readability hurts the game. It’s something that’s still being worked on. It does get easier as you familiarize yourself with it. The icons start to make more sense as you encounter them more and more. It does work after you’ve let the visuals soak into your brain for a while. I can now tell everything that’s going on in a battle fully zoomed out purely from the icons.
Unfortunately because the game has no budget and is worked on by volunteers only, someone skilled would need to volunteer their work to overhaul the visuals and sound design of the game. The current level of polish is what the current volunteers are capable of producing.
I’ve already submitted a ticket to the github to have all units icons superimposed onto the unit portraits to link them better. That would be a good first step. I’ve considered volunteering to do this myself but would need to teach myself how and haven’t had the time.
I think FrequentPilgrim is underselling the “hook of hooks” of this game, which is clearly the traction/repulsion juggling gundam motherfucker whose name i instantly forgot
john, talk about that thing, that’s what finally, completely sold me on the game
Honestly, I think “hey here are all these options and strategies but we’ve streamlined and put so much power in the interface that they’re not a nightmare of micro and apm” is a pretty good hook.
i was half-joking but i think that’s still just “come for the hardcore strategy, stay for the hardcore strategy” - you can only get a sense of that after having lots of the game explained to you
on the other hand, there’s a juggling gundam that can pull enemies in or launch them away
One of my favorite parts of this game is the spectator mode. You can watch any match that’s occurring in real time while chatting with other spectators and drawing on the map to point out interesting developments. All replays are recorded onto the website and can be loaded into the game to rewatch. I spectate as often as I actually play.
Here’s a 2v2 Matchmaker game I just watched in real time that I thought was particularly good. You can view it by having the game running and clicking the button on the web page that says “Watch Replay Now”. http://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/689022 It will automatically download and run the replay.
I’m always shocked by just how good the average match is. How much fun it is to analyze what each player was thinking and how they adapted to new information. It’s addictive.