I want to vote for Outrun 2 as well, even though Mario 64 is the only Mario game I like.
Okay, I forgot about Sunshine. That’s actually my favorite Mario game. Outrun 2 is still better though
There are many way to judge a game. Some people say a game can be sexy. And maybe Outrun 2 is a very sexy game well also
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@Sakurina Mario 64 and Nier Automata are both about exploring weird/mysterious places with an immensely satisfying to control character so maybe that’s not your thing
Having replayed Mario 64 in 2020 I’d say it owns because the controls are a little rough and because there aren’t a lot of invisible variables that help you not fall off platforms!
Mario 64 puts the focus into jumping like Death Stranding does to walking; just the simple act of jumping from platform to platform is a little risky, a little exciting. There are a lot of options available and you’re constantly making risk/reward micro decisions (backflip or double jump?)
In contrast, in something like mario 3D world or galaxy, jumping is a given, it’s never a challenge. Jumping from platform to platform itself doesn’t provide any excitement, and difficulty only comes from adding enemies and hazards to jumps
In essence this makes 64 actually close to earlier games like Mario 3, which did have exciting, hard to master jumping thanks to Mario’s inertia.
That’s a large part of why 64 has such a strong fan mod community that (mark my words) Galaxy or 3D world will never have
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Killer7
vs
Rondo of Blood
Both Killer7 and Rondo of Blood attempt to ape the high-contrast, low-key lighting found in paintings and film.
In Rondo of Blood the effect is more likened to chiaroscuro in painting. The effect on individual sprites is amazing, particularly for Dracula.
The effect is undermined, however, by technical limitations. Simulated lighting could not be programmed into the game. The lighting and colors for each sprite had to be drawn in isolation. There can be no unified light source beaming off of angles and creating shadows. The illusion is broken by necessity. The assets are still beautiful on their own, but together, it looks a bit like stickers placed on top of a background.
Killer7 has the benefit of technological progress and it uses the technology to great effect. The art director Akihiko Ishizaka managed to pull off a style that mirrors the artificial light tricks of noir. I’ve always thought that Tokyo Drifter must have influenced the look of the game. It’s good source material if you’re going to crib from something.
Yeah, I guess the lighting doesn’t make logical sense here either, but here, the artifice is used to create lines that cohere into a unified composition.
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This reminded me of the sprite parodies at the end of the Handsome Men fight.
I think sometimes Killer7’s visual style doesn’t get enough credit for how many disparate types of animation, pop art, and graphical design it features outside of the base gameplay.
I still recall the poster design (with all the Gundams and stuff) in the school being the first time I really realised how propaganda can make a point through context rather than just clumsy sloganism.
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if you “relinquish” in the face of mario64, it will love you back in a way very few other games will. it is completely unsurprising to me that mario64 from 20-odd years ago is still one of the biggest speedrunning games, and continues to get bigger and bigger despite speedrunning not even having been a thing when it was released.
speedrunning mario64 as a serious endeavor unerringly reveals the facets of linearity that exist within the game. the a-to-b obstacle courses were there all along, obscured by how many options the game gives you to experience itself and the complexity of even utilizing the movement in the necessary way
anyway mario64 is a very -rated game and i always support people shitting on games which are generally well-regarded!
give me a game that can make me feel like mario64 does and i’ll accept whatever trivial flaws - the feeling is unmatched and still unmatched to this day, despite an endless stream of imitators
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I just discovered yesterday that Katamari Damacy has finally been released on the PS4 (about a week ago). So I will soon be playing that game yet again.
Even the most well-regarded games always have detractors, or at least those who are indifferent toward them. Except one.
Has anyone during the course of this thing said a word against Katamari Damacy?
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Katamari Damacy stole my lunch money, stuffed me in a locker, and forcibly transmogrified me and everyone I love into a burning hot star.
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I was trying to think of a single critical word I could say against katamari the other day
I don’t like that the last mission is 20 minutes but uses a 5 minute song
The noises can get a little cacophonous for me as well, though I appreciate it in short bursts
…that’s all I can think of, really.
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I think this is a failing on my part tbh. I want to be able to say critical things of everything I love. Katamari fails that test and makes me think I might love it on nostalgia alone.
But I also think katamari might actually be perfect?
I guess it’s a slightly inaccessible game because I could not get Alicia to play it because of the control scheme. There, that’s a real criticism.
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i agree!
i think the biggest problem with katamari is also why some people prefer the sequel: it has some issues with getting it to do what you want. i’ll add that this is exacerbated by the methds of punishment the game uses for failure - you are often made to suffer in katamari due to a combination of being unable to control smoothly + the game not being lenient about what you can’t do. it’s bailed out here by generally being funny as hell in those moments, which lessens the frustration
i’ll ALSO add that time limits are among the worst constraints in video games. they almost never feel good. who dies by running out of time in a mario level and is like “ohhh, yeah i deserved that, feels good”
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i will make an exception for majora’s mask, a game which seems ever more distant from “fun” and somehow better for it?
Selectbutton
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I’m ride or die for Rondo but I gotta admit, putting Killer 7 screenshots next to Seijun Suzuki films is a damn fine argument.
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i’ve had access to outrun 2 spdx locally for years but i still find the home ports wonderful
I had to step up my game against that German-dubbed intro.
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Mario 64 is awesome because it’s an interesting exploration that’s trying to do a billion things and failing at half of them, and succeeding wildly at the other half.
Mario 64 has an edge to it. It’s brutal sometimes, wildly experimental at others. It’s extremely forgiving of ‘wrong’ approaches, and wants you to figure out all it’s weird nuances and toys to navigate the levels.
If You go Mario 3->Mario World->Donkey Kong 94->Yoshi’s Island and the way it fits into the series becomes a little more clear. The latter two games start experimenting with weird, almost awkward, ways of moving a character, and the nuances that can be gained from environmental factors interacting with Mario. Look at stuff like the Keys and Switches in DK94, the weird, roving, often circular levels of Yoshi’s island.
What 64 adds is the 3rd dimension, and the diorama puzzle box elements to the world. It’s definitely doing some really new things, but it’s all derived from stuff we see in earlier games.
And like…I dunno. Rough edges like Mario 64 has have become more engaging and endearing to me as I get older because so many games now are just greased tubes of content. Maybe there’s some nostalgia at play, but it’s definitely a game that I didn’t like as much as a kid that I’ve grown to appreciate more as I got older. I don’t think it’s a flawless game by any means, but like, it’s flaws are interesting ones.
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Shadow of the Colossus is boring red-light green-light game design. Basically cutscenes of a guy climbing. Fumito Ueda cries himself to sleep knowing he’ll never make something as visceral as playing on a CRAZY TAXI arcade cabinet.
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This. Yoshi’s Island was always a game I played at the Best Buy/Walmart kiosk until SM64 was free. I only got around to beating it earlier this year and I thought it was just fine but yes, I realised this was the missing link between the 2D games and SM64 with its many objectives and routes! It didn’t work for me as well in Yoshi’s Island but in the open-ended 3D realms of SM64 it’s a sublime virtue. It’s an interesting historical lens through which to look at SM64 and the fact that it still has a vibrant speedrunning/modding community speaks to its potency. It shares that special quality with another wellspring of 3D action: DOOM. SM64 has inspired and will inspire more people (players, watchers, creators) than Outrun 2 ever will. I don’t like being antagonistic towards that game (and have no particular negatives to hurl against it, just the positives of its rival because they happen to be facing off).
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Forgive me Riven
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This is a really poor argument for anything, really! Like on one hand: who cares? You either like something or your don’t, why give a fuck what other people think, how does that raise or lower its value On the other hand: what about inspiring the right kind of people with the right kind of ideas vs the masses? I’m sure A Bad Book which shall not be named has inspired more people than That Really Good Book That You Like. Does that matter to you? Does it make the good book worse or…?
I mean I totally agree with you that Mario 64 is more influential than Outrun 2 if we’re going by quantity, that’s facts. I just don’t like that used as an argument like that because it really isn’t one
Either way, I know this is all just for fun and I’m not taking it too seriously - I still just had to say that, for whatever reason